brand0o:
Id also like to add that if somehow a miracle happens and the game is released, that doesnt mean everything is just jolly.

Now everyone has played a game created by a hude corp. like WoW or whatever one time or another im sure. How many millions of bugs and problems were and are there? And these are HUGE teams,developers,corps. with hundreads if not even thousnads of employees. Can you imagine the problems of a 5 person team? I couldnt even imagine the game running smoothly at all.

hey lonelobo id like to hear what you think. What are the changes it running good and is it even possible. I find it highly unlikely. But i hope im proven wrong.

You make a good point, and I concede to it. But consider this: Large software development companies with many designers at their disposal tend to spread their resources thin, working on several projects at the same time, to create the illusion of efficiency, but once the games come out, they constantl need to be patched for bugs. Look at anything EA has released in the past few years, for example. So, being worked on exclusively by such a small team, Darkfall has an advantage, in that every one of the team members' sole focus is on the game. Bugs could be worked out relatively quickly, if/when a beta goes live. And if their suggestions are true that the beta, once released, will be of near-release quality, perhaps they've already taken into consideration your point, and are being anally meticulous about looking for bugs before letting it go to beta.

This may sound like I'm beating a dead horse, but, there's two sides to every coin: the game taking so long to come out MAY mean that it's vaporware and all a cleverly executed scam, as some theorists have put forth, *OR* it may also mean that the production of the game is being taken slowly and carefully, to minimize the amount of glitches.

Only time will tell.

everyone is entitled to an opinion. hell, everyone HAS an opinion even when they can't be bothered to search the facts more in depth. I have personally discussed the possibility of a business collaboration with Aventurine on the server infrastructure and I can tell you there is NOTHING even remotely suggesting they are not 100% serious on releasing this game as soon as it's ready.
No one can convince the vaporware supporters to stop. Even when there has been a 20 million Euro bond recently issued by Proton Bank to Aventurine probably for publication purposes;even when they have applied for logo and brand copyrights to the US Dpt of Commerce.
Oh well, lament on...

brand0o:
Id also like to add that if somehow a miracle happens and the game is released, that doesnt mean everything is just jolly.

Now everyone has played a game created by a hude corp. like WoW or whatever one time or another im sure. How many millions of bugs and problems were and are there? And these are HUGE teams,developers,corps. with hundreads if not even thousnads of employees. Can you imagine the problems of a 5 person team? I couldnt even imagine the game running smoothly at all.
.

I'm sorry but WoW simply does not have as many bugs as you claim , in fact WoW is practically bugless in comparrison with any other MMO game currently on the market. If you played star wars galaxies(before the big change that made the game one of the worst mmo's in history :P ) you would notice that they had bugs that were reported in closed beta and never even got fixed at all. I know its not the best comparison but as far as bug fixing goes blizzard are at the top of their game, it's just a shame they made WoW and not a game with the same ideas as darkfall. The only reason WoW is currently one of the best games out there is only because its one of the best made games on the market. They just copied an old mold of "mmo" gameplay but they implimented it better than any other games company ever did.

However, I agree with the idea that this game will probably never be released and they do not show enough footage and do not give enough away. I'm sick and tired of waiting for this type of mmo to hit the public domain without being in its beta stage on release. Let me explain myself...

I started playing mmo's properly when starwars galaxies was released, i'd played legend of mir before hand and tbh i was not impressed until SWG. Despite being pretty buggy I loved how "deep" the game was compared to the usual level grinding "pew pew" games available. the crafting was amazing and it even attracted people who were not gamers but were just playing to socialise, literally every element from social content to combat to crafting to creating your own cities and decorating your own home....it was all there.
then Sony changed the game to make it more "simple" like the other games on the market that I stopped playing...bad move they lost huge amounts of subscriptions. everyone was looking for a replacement for the game they lost.
ex-swg players put there hopes in Dark and Light which was, at the time currently in beta, the game offered all the things that ex-swg players wanted to fill the void of their lost game, but when it was released it was hugely buggy (not to mention they actually started selling beta keys!!...assholes!) and quite frankly unfinished.
Then vanguard came along...same ideas as dark and light (to an extent anyway) and they released it, and guess what the same again! buggy, unfinished crap!
So, now its fallen on Dark Fall, A game that offers all the same ideas that ex-swg and ex-uo players would have a "mmo wet dream" about. And I hate to say it but it just feels like history is going to repeat itself. given the very vague info we are given and limited screen shots and video. It just feels like they are hiding things from us.

I don't blame people for still holding out and following this game. After all even I still do. I hold out for one reason only, that someone has to get it right one day...maybe this game maybe not, but given the history you have to accept that people like me and others posting generally negative comments about this game , is just a given... lets hope the devs of darkfall take heed to the negative comments and prove us wrong.

there's nothing to prove on their part really. Either they have a product ready for release or they don't. Patience is a virtue.

steveyk:

brand0o:
Id also like to add that if somehow a miracle happens and the game is released, that doesnt mean everything is just jolly.

Now everyone has played a game created by a hude corp. like WoW or whatever one time or another im sure. How many millions of bugs and problems were and are there? And these are HUGE teams,developers,corps. with hundreads if not even thousnads of employees. Can you imagine the problems of a 5 person team? I couldnt even imagine the game running smoothly at all.
.

I'm sorry but WoW simply does not have as many bugs as you claim , in fact WoW is practically bugless in comparrison with any other MMO game currently on the market. If you played star wars galaxies(before the big change that made the game one of the worst mmo's in history :P ) you would notice that they had bugs that were reported in closed beta and never even got fixed at all. I know its not the best comparison but as far as bug fixing goes blizzard are at the top of their game, it's just a shame they made WoW and not a game with the same ideas as darkfall. The only reason WoW is currently one of the best games out there is only because its one of the best made games on the market. They just copied an old mold of "mmo" gameplay but they implimented it better than any other games company ever did.

You think WoW is bugless in comparison to other MMOs? That's hillarious. UO's first beta was less problematic than half the patches (which are supposed to fix bugs, not create new ones) Blizzard releases for WoW.

Here's a very recent example: They made absolutely NO changes to shoulders, but apparently orc-only shoulders have been completely screwed up. If you know anything about development what-so-ever, and read the patch notes for the patch that broke the graphics for the shoulders, you'd realize that monkeys could program better than Blizzard.

Galadourn:
everyone is entitled to an opinion. hell, everyone HAS an opinion even when they can't be bothered to search the facts more in depth. I have personally discussed the possibility of a business collaboration with Aventurine on the server infrastructure and I can tell you there is NOTHING even remotely suggesting they are not 100% serious on releasing this game as soon as it's ready.
No one can convince the vaporware supporters to stop. Even when there has been a 20 million Euro bond recently issued by Proton Bank to Aventurine probably for publication purposes;even when they have applied for logo and brand copyrights to the US Dpt of Commerce.
Oh well, lament on...

Why is it that when someone is questioning this product, a few people come forward and have either some affiliation with the developers, or the company, and can say things such as this. If they've applied to the US Dept of Commerce for brand copyrights, where's the evidence of this? Everything is public records these days, especially intellectual property and trademarking. Where's the proof?

And since we are on the subject of proof, where is the proof you've worked with this product? What company are you with? What were they looking into you for other than "server infrastructure"?

chaosloc:
(above post)

The following took me less than five minutes of searching on the internet:

About the loan, see:

http://www.iflr1000.com/default.asp?page=48&CH=3&CountryID=41&tcCountry=41&tcTitleID=81

You have to scroll down pretty far, but in summarizing the past year's financial moves, they briefly mention:

"...acting for Aventurine in relation to its issue of a €20 million convertible bond loan with Marfin Bank, and representing Proton Investment Bank on issuing a convertible bond loan through a private placement with an option to be traded through the Athens stock exchange."

**************

Then, regarding the copyrights with the US Department of Commerce, see:

http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=doc&state=b8i0h3.2.1

Word Mark DARKFALL
Goods and Services IC 009. US 021 023 026 036 038. G & S: Pre-recorded video cassettes, DVD's and compact discs featuring movies and videos, cartoons, recorded music and effects, and animated features on a fantasy game theme
IC 016. US 002 005 022 023 029 037 038 050. G & S: Books, comic books and pamphlets on a fantasy game theme

IC 025. US 022 039. G & S: Clothing items, namely shirts, shorts, sweatshirts, jackets, pants and hats with a fantasy game theme

IC 028. US 022 023 038 050. G & S: Toys and miniatures, namely, action figures, stuffed toy animals and playsets for role-playing, and play figures with a fantasy game theme

Mark Drawing Code (1) TYPED DRAWING
Serial Number 78284269
Filing Date August 7, 2003
Current Filing Basis 1B
Original Filing Basis 1B
Published for Opposition February 20, 2007
Owner (APPLICANT) Aventurine SA CORPORATION GREECE 362, Kiffisias Avenue, Halandri Athens 15233 GREECE
Attorney of Record Michael J. Hughes
Type of Mark TRADEMARK
Register PRINCIPAL
Live/Dead Indicator LIVE

and

http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=doc&state=b8i0h3.2.2

Word Mark DARKFALL
Goods and Services IC 009. US 021 023 026 036 038. G & S: Computer programs and software for playing fantasy games
IC 041. US 100 101 107. G & S: Entertainment, namely providing electronic fantasy games for individual and multi-player use via the Internet

Mark Drawing Code (1) TYPED DRAWING
Serial Number 78284311
Filing Date August 7, 2003
Current Filing Basis 1B
Original Filing Basis 1B
Owner (APPLICANT) Aventurine SA CORPORATION GREECE 362, Kiffisias Avenue, Halandri Athens 15233 GREECE
Attorney of Record Michael J. Hughes
Type of Mark TRADEMARK. SERVICE MARK
Register PRINCIPAL
Live/Dead Indicator LIVE

**********

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but it should at least be an educated opinion. I get the feeling that people would be complaining a lot less if they instead spent the time that they would be complaining doing their own research for the facts.

And anyway, the guy who says he discussed server infrastructure with Aventurine about Darkfall may not be able to legally give any more details without breaching a confidentiality of information agreement, or something, so give him a break.

lonelobo:
And anyway, the guy who says he discussed server infrastructure with Aventurine about Darkfall may not be able to legally give any more details without breaching a confidentiality of information agreement, or something, so give him a break.

Well, there's no confidentiality it was simply a business opportunity query I did acting on behalf of the company I work for but you're right, I won't give more details. Suffice it to say that yes, I did talk with Tasos and yes, he did sound pretty determined to release this thing asap.

WTF IS GOING ON HERE IS THE GAME COMING OUT OR NOT U GUYS NEED TO STOP FUCKING ARGUEING GET to the point and say what u need to say dont give a fucking 12000 word paragraph explaining a buncha shit and if its not coming out for a while owell who gives a shit and if so then quit argueing

Holy crap, this place is a kicked ant hill.

Darkfall is coming. If you don't believe this, then get out of these forums. Provide us some proof of your claims that it is vaporware. Start by disproving the large loan that Aventurine took out. While it's obviously not intended completely for Darkfall, it does imply that something Aventurine has going for it is good enough to purvey that money.

Edit: The Trademark: http://tarr.uspto.gov/servlet/tarr?regser=serial&entry=78284269
The Loan: Search for Aventurine http://www.iflr1000.com/default.asp?page=48&CH=3&CountryID=41&tcCountry=41&tcTitleID=81

Draugh:
Holy crap, this place is a kicked ant hill.

Darkfall is coming. If you don't believe this, then get out of these forums. Provide us some proof of your claims that it is vaporware. Start by disproving the large loan that Aventurine took out. While it's obviously not intended completely for Darkfall, it does imply that something Aventurine has going for it is good enough to purvey that money.

Edit: The Trademark: http://tarr.uspto.gov/servlet/tarr?regser=serial&entry=78284269
The Loan: Search for Aventurine http://www.iflr1000.com/default.asp?page=48&CH=3&CountryID=41&tcCountry=41&tcTitleID=81

Such old news.

All of this stuff was proven BS on the official forums YEARS ago.

Tasos has even stated on the official forums THAT SHIT ISNT REAL.

And to the guy saying "Patience is a virtue", well, 8 years waiting for a video game, how much more patient do you expect people to be?

Dulu:
And to the guy saying "Patience is a virtue", well, 8 years waiting for a video game, how much more patient do you expect people to be?

that's the definition of patience: as long as is needed. I can understand frustration, I have quit all my other MMOGs waiting for Darkfall( can't be bothered to play them when I know the features DF is going to have) but what else can one do?
I am currently engaging in all sorts of other activities while on the wait; tuning my car, getting my PhD done...that helps.

btw i was just using WoW as an example. all games are gonna have bugs no matter whats its impossible to have a busless game its just how many you gunna have?

For anyone who has played the orginal UO knows what a real mmog game is realli like. When EA took it over an ruined it was a bad day for uz UOers. The game was just done so right to the T. This game is close to the orginal UO. Wether the DF game is released time will only tell but instead of waiting around wit our thumbs in our butt, instead lets try and get it done ourselfs. Why not start a patishion? i mean if we get enough people then companies will have no choice to make our game. blizzard can put out a game extremely fast and could put one out faster starting fresh then DF could now. and the thing on our side is there is no other gme like ours then all the other lvl crab games. Why not give it a try there nothing to loose.

lonelobo:
I've been lurking on these forums for months now, but it's gotten to the point where I'm just sick and tired of how ignorant people can be. I've worked in software development, and I hope I can give insight into some of the topics that are frequently debated here.

Good post. The trolls troll for vindictive reasons, there is no doubt about it. No matter how many times you put up a good argument they will scream vapor. They only want to cry vapor as much as possible, and they will not stop till they say vapor 100000 times. They do this to get up their post counts so when new naive people come in here and see a "community member" having doubts the vapor myth will spread. You do not see this behavior tolerated in DF boards obviously, but here we have been told not interfere with free speech.

With that said, I again ask everyone not to respond to them, don't quote them, don't address them directly, just ignore them. Let them talk to themselves so that anyone reading the thread will see how they are ignored by the rest of us and thus their opinions hold no weight here.

Finally, I have been waiting for TF2 for 8 years, and I am glad it is coming out soon. I can't count how many times I have read people calling TF2 vapor. Eve Online was also in development for 10 years, and had its share of vapor screaming people too, but its launch and success, for a small company, is unparalleled. In both cases I have never seen the effort put forth by supposed individuals to cast doubt on a game as is the case for DF. But like Eve and TF2, DF can come out or not. I could care less. If it does, I will buy it and give it a try, just like every other worthy game on the shelf.

chaosloc:

steveyk:

brand0o:
Id also like to add that if somehow a miracle happens and the game is released, that doesnt mean everything is just jolly.

Now everyone has played a game created by a hude corp. like WoW or whatever one time or another im sure. How many millions of bugs and problems were and are there? And these are HUGE teams,developers,corps. with hundreads if not even thousnads of employees. Can you imagine the problems of a 5 person team? I couldnt even imagine the game running smoothly at all..

I'm sorry but WoW simply does not have as many bugs as you claim , in fact WoW is practically bugless in comparrison with any other MMO game currently on the market. If you played star wars galaxies(before the big change that made the game one of the worst mmo's in history :P ) you would notice that they had bugs that were reported in closed beta and never even got fixed at all. I know its not the best comparison but as far as bug fixing goes blizzard are at the top of their game, it's just a shame they made WoW and not a game with the same ideas as darkfall. The only reason WoW is currently one of the best games out there is only because its one of the best made games on the market. They just copied an old mold of "mmo" gameplay but they implimented it better than any other games company ever did.

You think WoW is bugless in comparison to other MMOs? That's hillarious. UO's first beta was less problematic than half the patches (which are supposed to fix bugs, not create new ones) Blizzard releases for WoW.

Here's a very recent example: They made absolutely NO changes to shoulders, but apparently orc-only shoulders have been completely screwed up. If you know anything about development what-so-ever, and read the patch notes for the patch that broke the graphics for the shoulders, you'd realize that monkeys could program better than Blizzard.

lol, such a game breaking bug. I stand defeated ...not. Every game has bugs, WoW definately does not have the most by a long shot. And you dont have to be "all knowing" about development to work that out. I suggest u play more MMO, it's impossible to find a bugless game.

p.s. the worst WoW bug I came across was when druids furor talent stopped working, making it extremely hard for me to pvp with my druid.

brand0o:
btw i was just using WoW as an example. all games are gonna have bugs no matter whats its impossible to have a busless game its just how many you gunna have?

For anyone who has played the orginal UO knows what a real mmog game is realli like. When EA took it over an ruined it was a bad day for uz UOers. The game was just done so right to the T. This game is close to the orginal UO. Wether the DF game is released time will only tell but instead of waiting around wit our thumbs in our butt, instead lets try and get it done ourselfs. Why not start a patishion? i mean if we get enough people then companies will have no choice to make our game. blizzard can put out a game extremely fast and could put one out faster starting fresh then DF could now. and the thing on our side is there is no other gme like ours then all the other lvl crab games. Why not give it a try there nothing to loose.

I actually like the idea...but if something like this did come about, it would be a very sad day for online gaming. One things for sure, DF sure does attract a lot of attention from gamers that want more from their chosen MMO. Games developers would be stupid to not pay attention...which so far is proving to be the case.

Dulu:

Draugh:
Holy crap, this place is a kicked ant hill.

Darkfall is coming. If you don't believe this, then get out of these forums. Provide us some proof of your claims that it is vaporware. Start by disproving the large loan that Aventurine took out. While it's obviously not intended completely for Darkfall, it does imply that something Aventurine has going for it is good enough to purvey that money.

Edit: The Trademark: http://tarr.uspto.gov/servlet/tarr?regser=serial&entry=78284269
The Loan: Search for Aventurine http://www.iflr1000.com/default.asp?page=48&CH=3&CountryID=41&tcCountry=41&tcTitleID=81

Such old news.

All of this stuff was proven BS on the official forums YEARS ago.

Tasos has even stated on the official forums THAT SHIT ISNT REAL.

And to the guy saying "Patience is a virtue", well, 8 years waiting for a video game, how much more patient do you expect people to be?

Uhhh..proof that he said that ? I don't recall them saying anything about the loan.

talon tortilleni:
WTF IS GOING ON HERE IS THE GAME COMING OUT OR NOT U GUYS NEED TO STOP FUCKING ARGUEING GET to the point and say what u need to say dont give a fucking 12000 word paragraph explaining a buncha shit and if its not coming out for a while owell who gives a shit and if so then quit argueing

You're ignorant..shut up. if you're too lazy to read a "discussion" then don't read it...

roboshop:
I'm so sorry guys but I've gone through all the videos and content I can find on this game and it's vaporware.

There is nothing in any of the "so called" gameplay videos that can't be done through scripting in a photoshop style application. They may even have some novice 3D Studio users to do some of the fighting and animation scenes it's not real gameplay footage.

I'm not going to claim to be working in the industry any more and I haven't worked in the games industry since the Atari ST was prevalent.

Just look at the facts that's all I'm saying.

Sometimes when something is too good to be true, it's just too good to be true.

Make your own minds up but please don't pre-order or make any kind of beta key payments as you will likely never see that money again. If this ever becomes genuine because it isn't currently then they will offer a free closed and possibly free open beta at some stage.

This game idea probably started as an idea amongst University/College students, a website was born, a few animations scenes and screenshots put up and maybe just maybe it attracted some low level financing that allowed them to invest some time in producing more and more characters and animation in the hope of atracting further investment.

My opinion and it's only my opinion but if you look at what the videos show, ignore the text overlays that talk about features but just look at what the videos and trailers actually demonstrate then I'd say the game engine itself doesn't exist yet.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=6LC0KrZO79g seems to me thats real enough
also what your saying is any vid ive seen of any game before beta coulda of been done byt htta methods even the beta vids so wtf?

ALso look at all these 2001-2007 screens and vids http://www.wonderbrick.com/darkfall

nvm LOL

Panchoe, well said. EVE was also a game that took many years to complete. The reason was simply because they were only two or three at first. Later on they were about five or six. But, it came out and now there are a few million players playing the game.
For all you really, really negative people: The creators of EVE are from Iceland(like me, yay), they started the idea when Iceland wasn't really that "future-ish" in technology but they didn't quit and now it's a huge game with a huge number of players. Who says that DF can't be the same? They are not that many making the game and like EVE it's supposed to be f***ing big. Which gets me thinking. EVE and DF are very much alike. You do what you want, where you want and when you want it.

I know that saying that Iceland wasn't that "future-ish" doesn't really make that much sense. But consider why I would say something like that. Most people ask me if we have computers in Iceland. Of course that doesn't make sense but it shows that Iceland is small enough for that kind of a joke. But look what a few guys, who had a dream, went for it and made of the dream. Why can't the DF guys be the same? You can't answer it. You just have to wait and see.

But there is one thing I don't understand. If the BETA is coming out why is no "gamesite" like Gamespot or the game section on IGN posting news or wanting interviews or something. One report in 2001 of Darkfall coming out in 2003, that's it. I think it's time to advertise or something so that more people will know of this games existence. I'm afraid that even though they would release the game, and it would be amazing, only about 50k people would buy it and play it. That's pretty much the number of players who are following news and waiting for the BETA. That might be the end of a great beginning. Example: Lotro f***ing sucked, but there are still about a million people playing it, at least a million copies were bought. And about 1/4 of those played the beta. That's a little more than the people that are going to play the BETA of DF.
This 50k i talk about isn't exact of course but that's about the number i would guess that are registered on the DF forums, and about 50k views on youtube of every video(i know it's youtube but still). Only trailer there that has 200k views is "Darkfall is coming" but that's really old and i guarantee that not all of those views come from Darkfall fans.

Correct me if I'm wrong. :)

what ever you say its your opion bud its called a nda but LOL have fun playing lal the wow clones beta is this year i can garrentee it

plus there not sure on the beta date there not goign to annunce beta like they did back in 2005 and gt slamed for by having to delay it by a week or 2 just give it a lil more time before you go make excuses on vaporware look outside the box and not put darkfall in the smae shoes as the other gay mmorpgs

Ahh. I think you misunderstood me a little bit. I'm not complaining about the BETA announcement or anything. I'm just wondering why nobody is following the game progress except for us, the fans. What i mean is that almost every game has previews and interviews and stuff like that on the game. They are constantly asking the developers if they want to tell the fans of a release date and the release date of the BETA. Is it because they are not working in America or? Could be it. I'm just wondering why there is so little interest in the game from the "big" gamesites. Even mmorpg.com haven't updated the Darkfall section in almost a year. Only some Ork info but that was just some backround. Nothing about the game itself.

no worrys they will allc ome running when it goes beta just 7 years is a bit long to wait : )
i didnt start waiting untill last month or so just cause i was pretty sure beta will be this year given the indications

trust me there tons of people waiting if the game is what it is promised to be O_o it will blow all these new mmorpgs out of the water this company is just a bit more tit lipped than most just think out of the box : )

I just love pvp, loved SB so much.
I woud really whant to play this game !

But me and all my friends will only give this game 6more months, if they dont realease a beta in 6month we will never play this game. caus they make all of us so pissed.
7 years is way to long time.
well they will lose me and my 7 irl friends. Well i think if the dont realese the beta soon they will lose many many more ppl around the world.

sadly

so please hurry up ppl!

if they waited 6 months they would be screwing them selves this year mark my words for beta : )

brand0o:
Heres an idea also. If theres so many people that we think there are that love the UO/DF style then why not start some sort of patishion like. Theres many things that were created because of them and if this company cant get it done then why not try and find another one who could? Its not a bad idea and theres nothing to loose right?

You mean a petition?

thats if they dont get it done we are goign to have to beg a big company do it but they wont listen anyways

Man, you all got too much time on your hands....but then so must I after reading this forum and registering so I could finally throw in my ten bob.

I'll keep my thoughts brief as to where I think DF is going, suffice to say I just cancelled my EQ2 subscription for a break over Christmas and the new year with a view to starting a new game subscription around March time which in all likelihood with be AoC. It's a shame, I've been following the news for DF for over a year now and although it does sound like the best mmorpg out there, in principle I can't believe it will be ready by March (2008).

Like people have said before in this forum, there is a balancing process that takes place in-game...indeed after 3 years SOE were still balancing EQ2!

If they want to make money from this game then the developers need to get it beta asap, get ppl in before AoC, then with huge potential subscription base it should be no problem selling it to a publisher. Afterall, you have to be in it to win it!

Succeed or fail I'll be a winner because I'll either be ploughing my monthly subscription into Darkfall or AoC and playing a decent mmo, the choice is yours.

Another thing - seems as the developer that started this thread asked for our comments, how about they close the thread with another update or just reply defending the negative comments.

We all have busy lives but in reality we can all spare 30 minutes to post some feedback - if it really means that much to us - so come on DF developers does it really mean this much to you?

heh yea they cant hold out on beta to much longer but go read dev journal 15 it has ot be very soon they have a date planend now : ) they will annunce it AOC will be decent but i think it has to many instances

Because if Blizzard or any other large company got rights to Darkfall, they'd turn it into Carebearland 4: Return of the Faeries (Not an actual game, but you get the idea). They'd utterly kill the PvP part of it, to appeal to the newbs, so they could have more subscribers for it. I've been playing UO for 10 years, since it's Beta, and would love to play a game that reminds me of the good old days.

I've seen what happens when you try to rush a game, like what EA just recently did and rushed the release of Ultima Online: Kingdom Reborn, hell, they even rushed the Beta of it. Kingdom Reborn is basically a "revamped" version of Ultima Online: Third Dawn (Which introduced a "3D" client, was nothing more then a graphic and user interface change, UO 2D is still around). Oh, the horror stories i could tell you of UO: KR...

I've also seen what happens when you take your time on a game. The Elder Scrolls II: Daggerfall was released in 1996, 2 years after The Elder Scrolls I: Arena. Daggerfall was nicknamed "Buggerfall" because of all the bugs in it, most would cause CTDs. The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind was released in 2002, 6 years after Daggerfall. Morrowind had MUCH fewer bugs than Daggerfall, and was innovative at the time, one of the Best Sellers of the Year. The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion was released in 2006, 4 years after Morrowind, and it shook the gaming world to it's foundations with it's features. It's Radiant AI, Havoc Physics Engine, and most importantly, it's Open Source coding. Meaning that while your at a Inn in Anvil, NPCs and Monsters would actually be walking around and interacting with each other and the environment, outside of the "cell" your in, all across the game world. The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion is the first game to use Open Source coding.

Generally, the longer a game takes to make, the better it's gonna be. I'd rather them spend 7-8 years making the game, and making it good, than them make a game in 3 years that turns out to be a complete pile of $#!t. Quality Over Quantity.

W/E the case.... The game should not have been announced this early...

It is only harmful for the game itself and it is a pain for anyone who discovers the game now, near now, and any point before.

not sure if the game will be published. games getting released by small companies are always a crapshoot. but, as far as the game development making progress, i can attest to that since i'm in alpha testing.

Heh, I sure hope it comes out, I have confidence in it, despite the naysayers. The developers shouldn't rush themselves, no matter how many people are complaining- rushing leads to a bad game with many bugs. If this really were just a joke, I don't think they'd put so much work into this, or try to keep it going for so long. When it does come out, the naysayers will be sorry, cause this game will kick @$$.